The Conscious Cut

Ep. 4 Redressing Fashion: Tackling Fashion's Waste w/ Nissa Cornish

• Season 1 • Episode 4

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In this episode of The Conscious Cut, we speak with Nissa Cornish, a former model turned sustainability advocate and Executive Director at Redress, Hong Kong’s leading sustainable fashion nonprofit. Drawing on her firsthand experience with the fashion industry’s waste problem, Nissa shares how Redress is driving change through initiatives like the Redress Design Award, partnerships with schools and government bodies, and citywide clothing collection systems. We dive into the challenges of recycling complex materials, the importance of educating consumers on sustainable fashion, and efforts to destigmatize secondhand clothing. With Redress Month approaching, featuring clothing drives and volunteer events, learn how you can support circular fashion and reduce the environmental impact of your wardrobe.

Nissa Cornish is Executive Director at Redress Hong Kong.

Thank you for listening!

HOIKI LIU
Welcome back to The Conscious Cut. Last time, we sat down with Dr. Christina Dean, founder of Redress, to unpack the big picture of sustainable fashion, exploring how Asia's manufacturing giants and global trends are shaping a more circular economy. Today, we're zooming in with Misa Karnas, Redress Director of Partnerships, to get a closer look at what's happening right here with each of us. Based in Hong Kong, Nisa is the force behind building partnerships and campaigns that make sustainability real by sparking action. Like the upcoming Redress month in May that brings sustainability home to our closets and community. Nisa, I'm so happy to have you here with us. Let's go dive right into the details. Thank you for having me. So first, let's start with a bit on your background. You joined Redress seven years ago. Why did you join Redress? What brought you to Hong Kong and what brought you to Redress?

NISSA CORNISH
I have a pretty unique story that almost seems like it was custom designed for me to end up at Redress. I came to Hong Kong in 2000, 2001. I was a model at the time. And so as a model, I got really up close and personal with the fashion industry and how wasteful it was. It made an impression on me how wasteful and marketing -driven and trend -driven fashion was. But there wasn't anything I could do about it. I mean, I was a model, so I just kind of did the job. And then as that career tapered off, I began doing a lot of volunteering and found my passion working in environmental nonprofits. And I worked at a nonprofit called the Hong Kong Cleanup for a number of years. and developed my knowledge and my network around sustainability so that when the opportunity to work at Redress came up in 2018, it was like this beautiful convergence of my passion for fashion and my passion for sustainability and my knowledge of both of those areas. I was like, there's nowhere else I could work that would be such a perfect use of what my life experience has been so far. So, and it has been amazing. Now being able to work in a place that addresses the issues I used to see as a model, it's like come full circle. It's really fantastic for me.

HOIKI LIU
Okay, so that's a very clear path and picture. It all led up to this point. One of my guests that has the most clear paths and pictures to date, like, you know, this was what I was doing, so obviously. And yet it was all kind of these random experiences that just led,

NISSA CORNISH
it was all kind of these random experiences that just led, you know, I didn't even know this was going to happen, but it all led to the right thing for me.

HOIKI LIU
Yeah. And I mean, it's actually, I follow you on Instagram, so I can see from your stories, your whole lifestyle just falls right into this sustainability practice. I mean, that's how you live.

NISSA CORNISH
live. Yeah, I grew up in Canada and I'm very much a tree hugger, a bit of a hippie at heart. You know, I love camping. I love nature. I live, like you said, in Mui Wo. So we're surrounded by greenery and animals all the time. I love that for my son too. I have a seven -year -old that I think being in nature fuels your understanding and passion for conservation and for protecting the environment. So that's definitely part of it.

HOIKI LIU
And it's so great because it's actually, it's Earth Month. So that, you know, living in such a space helps also you remind yourself that like, we didn't actually bring up Earth Month or anything like that because it's just... Well, every day is Earth Day, right? We're on this Earth. Every day, it should be. Every day is Earth Day. But yeah, it's great that, you know, it's already part of your lifestyle. So it's not like, let's recognize this or let's celebrate this. This is just how you live. Yeah,

NISSA CORNISH
I do like Earth Day as a chance for everybody to celebrate together, though. Like, yeah.

HOIKI LIU
And to recognize the actions that we're taking. Yeah, to have a moment and reflect. Okay, but back to Redress and back to your role at Redress. So you're the one that's managing the teams that forges partnerships across different brands and locally. I mean, can you tell me a little bit more in detail? What exactly, what kind of partnerships do you guys forge and what is it that you guys do?

NISSA CORNISH
We have a really wide variety of partnerships. because of what we do. So we do work with fashion industry, so brands and parts of the manufacturing supply chain. Primarily, we work with designers, as Christina will have shared with you through our Redress Designer Award program and our education and empowerment of designers. That's a core part of our mission. So in order to do that, we do a lot of partnerships in the fashion industry. But here in Hong Kong, we also do a lot of partnerships with just regular corporations that want to make a difference for the better. that want to engage and educate their employees. We partner with schools, we partner with the government. And importantly, we also partner with a lot of charities here in Hong Kong because one of our programs collects clothing that is unwanted from the public and redistributes it with the aim of having that clothing stay in use longer. And it just so happens that although our mission is environmental, that program also has a social angle because it serves those social charities by providing them clothes that they need. and removing the burden from them of having to collect directly from the public. So yeah, we do have a lot of partnerships that serve a lot of different purposes.

HOIKI LIU
It's actually really important because a lot of times people think about donating clothes. Actually, a lot of stuff that we donate might not actually serve the right purpose for... That's a good point.

NISSA CORNISH
point.

HOIKI LIU
Yeah. As a matter of fact, I actually make a lot of down jackets, but I have in the past. donated my down jackets to say like impact where they've helped me pass it up but really they only needed that for that one year that one winter because the next winter like I myself I'm wearing a down jacket that I made back in 2010 so you know they don't need it repeatedly and you know of course there's a lot of times people are donating things like maybe occasional wear and you know as a person who's just trying to survive like I'm not cleaning your streets in a ball gown.

NISSA CORNISH
No, that's a really good point that I think a lot of people miss. And we do experience that at Redress and we educate around it. People assume that if they donate their clothing to charity, that that's sort of like, I've done a good deed and I can feel comfortable and happy about the fact that I haven't done my clothing in the rubbish. What a lot of people don't realize is when you give your clothing to a charity, a lot of the time the charities they don't have the capacity or the manpower to like go through your unwanted things and cherry pick the things they can use at that moment they don't have the storage to store the things they can't use at that moment and they don't have the resource to find other solutions for the stuff that they can't use so a lot of the time that charity is doing the work for you and relieving you of the guilt of just they take what they need and then they pass it it goes to landfill anyway sometimes or elsewhere so That's why I really like what we do, because we're able to really work closely with the charities and we collect clothing, all types of clothing from people. But we say to our partner charities, what do you need right now this month? And a children's charity will say, well, we just need maybe three boxes of clothing for children under three. Or Impact Hong Kong, which is an amazing charity for the unhomed. requests like we just need one box of men's coats right now you know and so that that relieves a burden on them it serves our purpose by making sure we send the clothes where they really will get used and worn yeah it's fantastic but it's true that that that that people feeling that they're donating clothes is a bit of a something that we need to we want we want that perspective to evolve that we understand that that's not an ultimate solution yeah so i think that's so great i mean this is not

HOIKI LIU
so i think that's so great i mean this is not part of the plan so far, but I'm just going to say that. Because that is what part of Get Redressed Month is about, right? A huge part of the program is about bringing in companies, volunteers, just everyday people to come and sort. Because only when you do the sorting is when you realize, like... donating is not the end and it's not the solution at all like we actually need to get the right things into the right hands and and nowhere to put the things that's unwanted at the end of the day because people seem to forget that warehouse charges in hong kong's insane like yeah no one has has space for your trash right and people tend to donate winter clothes at the end of winter things like that

NISSA CORNISH
Because only

HOIKI LIU
is not the end and it's not the solution at all like we actually need to get the right things into the right hands and and nowhere to put the things that's unwanted at the end of the day because people seem to forget that warehouse charges in hong kong's insane like yeah no one has has space for your trash right and people tend to donate winter

NISSA CORNISH
clothes at the end of winter things like that And also, you mentioned something earlier that I think is important to note, which is that, yeah, not all clothing can have a second life. Even we, we collect clothing with the sole purpose of finding a new life for your unwanted stuff. But some of your unwanted stuff, nobody wants. You know, we got, in the wake of COVID, we got donated tons and tons of business suits, good quality Italian wool business suits, and we couldn't find homes for them. We had to downcycle a portion of them. And to this day, we struggle to find homes for business suits sorry to this day we struggle to find homes for business suits also company uniforms things like company volunteer day 2022 like nobody else is going to wear that clothing so if you're going to donate clothing we have a very strict code about donating clothing that is wearable with dignity and suits the lifestyles of the people that we're donating it to and hopefully like the

NISSA CORNISH
this day we struggle to find homes for business suits also company uniforms things like company volunteer day 2022 like nobody else is going to wear that clothing so if you're going to donate clothing we have a very strict code about donating clothing that is wearable with dignity and suits the lifestyles of the people that we're donating it to and

HOIKI LIU
hopefully like the The community that's bringing in our stuff for donation, we can educate them further for them to start sorting their donations before coming in, right? Because like you said, manpower, especially for a charity, like we don't, you don't have money to hire manpower. And it's really all counting on volunteers. So if the donors can go just, you know, a step further to first sort what they're bringing in to let you know, you know, what's useful. And I mean, maybe it's, it's a chance for... us to push to the public that and and do further education with even the design awards that you guys have you know like teaching designers to actually design from existing existing clothing yeah so there's things that like you it doesn't really make sense to donate to there's there's clothing that doesn't really make sense to donate to people

NISSA CORNISH
know, you

HOIKI LIU
and do further education with even the design awards that you guys have you know like teaching designers to actually design from existing existing clothing yeah so there's things that like you it doesn't really make sense to donate to there's

NISSA CORNISH
there's things

HOIKI LIU
there's clothing that doesn't really make sense to donate to people that they'll need it for those occasions. So for occasional wear, maybe that's where you look at how do we redesign these pieces. Absolutely,

NISSA CORNISH
yeah. And there are some really cool designers, alumni of our Redress Design Award that are doing amazing things. There's a local designer called Mayan Chen who upcycles wedding gowns. A number of designers who upcycle shirts and suits and things like that. So that's definitely a way to deal with. But the volume of weight, especially pre -consumer, because you think, okay, People throw away a certain number of suits, shirts, dresses, whatever. But there's also so much waste happening before it ever hits the stores, which a lot of people don't even realize. And a lot of designers in our alumni network are now looking at how to deal with that kind of waste. Yeah,

HOIKI LIU
because I was speaking to a recycling plant. Now, this is a podcast that's supposed to come out. But because I wasn't physically at the plant, I realized it's difficult for the audience to understand if I'm just talking about it. But it's something that maybe I can line up with redress because, you know, a lot of people don't realize for recycling, it's much easier recycling textile wastage than it is to recycle a piece of garments. Because there's so many components on your garments. And a lot of times, even when it comes to textile recycling, we always say if the textile, it's one material, a single origin material. It's much easier to recycle than it is of a mixed fiber content, you know, like your polyester cotton. That's right. It's very difficult to, when those things are into tiny filaments, it's hard to split them up and to recycle each part, you know. So a lot of times this is where we have to down cycle. So the same with garment recycle, it's actually the same thing. More often than not, it can only be a down cycle process if it's not recreated. And a lot of people don't realize that.

NISSA CORNISH
it's not recreated. And a lot of people don't realize that. They think they're giving their clothes to be recycled and it's not recyclable. And even more so, clothing doesn't often, a lot of clothing that's post -consumer that people have worn, it no longer has the label. You don't actually know what fibers are in it, whether it's mixed or pure fibers.

HOIKI LIU
actually know what

NISSA CORNISH
So there's a lot of barriers to us being able to recycle people's clothing. Also,

HOIKI LIU
again, it comes back to manpower. Because let's say you have a jacket, you know, you've got your snaps, you've got this zipper.

NISSA CORNISH
again, it

NISSA CORNISH
Yeah, putting off labels and zippers and buttons and embellishments in order to have what remains of the jacket. to be recyclable, it's very costly. It's very costly. Not very practical at the moment. No, yeah.

HOIKI LIU
It's very

HOIKI LIU
So, I mean, I think just helping the consumer recognize these issues will hopefully remind people that they should be more mindful from the get -go when they make up something or they buy something. Yeah, absolutely. So, I'd like to also further keep talking about Redress Month because I know that's a huge thing that's coming up in May. How are you guys bringing in the volunteers? Who are the people that volunteer with you guys?

NISSA CORNISH
Get Redress Month is a huge citywide campaign and we engage a lot of companies and schools. So the companies and schools participate in our campaign through a clothing drive, often through lunch and learns or educational talks. And they also participate by volunteering. So we have an event called the Source -a -thon. Through the Get Redress Month clothing drive, we collect something like 20 tons of clothing. 20 tons of clothing would fill this room, floor to ceiling. So it's a lot of clothing and we need to sort it in a very short period of time. So we bring those, a lot of the time, those same companies come in and help us sort the clothing. The Sortathon is a three -day event. We're sorting basically morning till night with volunteer teams. And it's quite an exciting thing. And we also need a lot of volunteers to support the teams that are sorting the clothing. moving boxes around and training and support and just watching and making sure everything's running smoothly. So we recruit a lot of volunteers at this time of year. And then after the Swordathon, we also hold one of our very popular and very famous secondhand pop -up shops, which again, needs a huge volume of volunteers to make it happen. So we recruit volunteers in Hong Kong, mainly through a platform called Hands -On Hong Kong, an amazing organization that connects volunteers with charities. And I'm really happy to say that we have a lot of volunteers who come back time after time because they see the value of participating in our work.

HOIKI LIU
That's so great. So our audience will now know if they want to get involved. Yes, and volunteer with us. Hands on Hong Kong. Go sign up. All right. Okay, so that's, and Get Redress Month is about a whole month of May, right? There's different things happening along the way. That's right. Get Redress Month happens in May.

NISSA CORNISH
Month happens in May. It extends into June in the sense that the clothing drive and public education campaign happened throughout May. And also our public exhibition, which is this year at Hong Kong Design Centre in Shem Shui Po. Come visit. And then in June is a sort -a -thon where we deal with the results of the clothing drive and then our pop -up shop. So it kind of trickles into June as well. Okay,

HOIKI LIU
that's great. I mean, and it is a whole... This is where you actually get to see how this industry can be circular. Because usually it's the end cycle where people can't figure out, how can I be circular? Because it's not like buying a drink from a convenience store. And when you're done with that, like your can or your bottle. The place, the solution that we know about. Yes, exactly. With clothing, it's actually very up in the air. And that's why we're the second largest polluting industry. There is no infrastructure for that.

NISSA CORNISH
The place, the solution that we know about. Yes, exactly. With clothing,

NISSA CORNISH
Yeah. On the industry side, there's a very, very, it's very, very young at the moment. And on the consumer side, there's just, there's growing awareness. But the trend with awareness is that you have to get to a certain point of awareness before behavior starts to change with consumers. So that, yeah, the Get Reach last month is a really great opportunity for us to show consumers easy ways that they actually can already participate in circularity.

HOIKI LIU
Okay, let's go back a little bit because I think Get Redress Month is great. But besides Get Redress Month now, so Hong Kong fashion is everywhere we go. You know, like people come from around the world just to shop in Hong Kong because it's such a huge fashion hub. Be it in Central and Causeway, Tsim Shao Shui for your luxuries or Sun Shui Po with your secondhand shops. What is... With all this energy into consuming in this city, how do you guys tap into it and remind everybody about circularity? What are some habits that you guys are trying to shift with the consumerism here?

NISSA CORNISH
Our main fundamental thing that we are hoping consumers will recognize and take on as a behavioral change is just keeping clothes in use longer and that can take so many different forms that can be buying higher quality clothing that can be passing it along by swapping or handing down to other people in your family or sharing with friends by repairing restyling upcycling your own clothes and that that

NISSA CORNISH
that Group of ways that you can make sure your clothing stays in use longer is a really fundamental way for consumers to behave that will support a circular fashion system. Because currently, most of us tend to see fashion a little bit as disposable because the prices and the quality of the majority of fashion out there lean towards disposable level. So in terms of keeping clothing in use longer, we also... ask people to consider embracing the resale market by giving or selling clothes themselves and secondhand shopping. So our pop -up shop is a big opportunity for people to try secondhand shopping. And we make a really big effort for our pop -up shops to dispel the stigma of secondhand clothing being dusty or unhygienic or not fun to shop or, you know, only for those who really need it from an economic standpoint. And our pop -up shops, by and large, are beautiful, exciting, bright, colorful, fun shopping experiences where you can find a treasure and bring it home. And they are still wildly affordable because secondhand clothing is that way. So asking people to consider that shopping secondhand is a really viable way to supplement your closet rather than buying new is one of them as well.

HOIKI LIU
How has that been working in the last few years? I assume during COVID, it's going to be difficult because people are like... Being so hygienic at that time, they don't even want to talk to another person or be in the vicinity of another person. So, you know, maybe buying somebody else's old clothes was like, you know,

NISSA CORNISH
know,

HOIKI LIU
hopefully at the time people weren't even considering shopping. Yeah, right. I mean, how has the trend changed before COVID, during COVID and now past COVID? Like, do you see the acceptance of Hong Kong? I ask this because... It's rare in Hong Kong, I almost want to say. It's rare because it's a very, it's in the culture. Like you said, people want new things, you know, like old is not good, new is good. It's just so worked into the culture, especially Chinese culture.

NISSA CORNISH
you know, like

HOIKI LIU
But seeing that, actually, I was in Paris for Fashion Week last year, September. And there was, you know, obviously in Paris, there's a lot of secondhand shops that sells very premium things. really nice and pristine. Like you don't recognize it as a secondhand shop walking in. You just think it's a lovely boutique shop, you know, a really nice boutique shop. And then you see like vintage Hermes, you know, but they will also have stuff like maybe old costs, you know, so it varies in price range and things, obviously, but it's so popular in Paris. In fact, one of the shops that I walked into, I sold something that I brought to Paris just because I was like,

NISSA CORNISH
know,

HOIKI LIU
Oh, I won't need this winter jacket. I sold them a padded leather jacket that I've had for like 20 years. And I thought, you know, I never really wear this anymore. But I'm in Paris this time. It's the right weather for us. So I brought it. And then I realized even my five days in Paris, I didn't wear it. I was like, it's not something that I feel like it's me anymore.

NISSA CORNISH
it's not

HOIKI LIU
like it's me anymore. So when I went by the second half shop, I was like, why don't I just try to sell it and see if someone will take it? And they did. And not only that, what I wanted to say was the secondhand shop that I finally sold my jacket at was run by a Chinese from China.

NISSA CORNISH
China.

HOIKI LIU
Excellent. Yeah. So, you know, like I feel like that like Chinese people only want new things. The stigma is starting to lift.

NISSA CORNISH
Well, I mean, in Hong Kong, we have seen a huge, we don't have hardcore numerical data, but just based on our pop -up shops and our... secondhand shop that's permanent in Shamshui Po, which opened in 2020. In the seven plus years I've been at Redress, we've been running pop -up shops and we started out fairly small and we've grown and grown and grown consistently. Every pop -up shop that we run has more foot traffic, more sales, both in number of items and in sales figures and more buzz. And so for us, we're seeing more people being attracted to shopping secondhand, which is really gratifying to see. And I think in Hong Kong, there's different drivers for people to buy secondhand. Right. One is obviously economic, like to find something that's really high quality for cheap, you know, is probably as appealing, if not more appealing than finding something that's cheap because it's poor quality. New. Right. So and then there's the sustainability component, which does impact people. Some people do want to shop secondhand to relieve the pressure they're creating on the planet. Then there's the sort of trendy fashion, I want to find something that nobody else has because it's vintage or not available this season anywhere else. That's the components. We do get a lot of fashion bloggers and influencers and things like that, shopping secondhand in our pop -ups. And for a lot of people, it's a combination of these drivers, right? I think in Hong Kong, we have been trying to access people by...

HOIKI LIU
I think in

NISSA CORNISH
have been trying to access people by... pushing those different ways that secondhand shopping is appealing and attractive. It's not just because you can't afford better clothes. It's because you can get really beautiful, high quality stuff at a really affordable price. And it happens to also be more sustainable. Like it's kind of a win -win.

HOIKI LIU
I also find now it's actually, it's quite... it's not that it's entertaining, but it's like, it's a fun thing to do. Oh yeah. And the treasure hunt. Yeah. It's really fun. And then like when you go with a group of friends and you compare, it's like, Oh, look what I found. Cause you know, it's not like going to a shop where it's like, Oh, I really like this. And it's like, Oh, I really like this too. Do they have it? You know, it's like, no, like you each have to go hunt for your own treasures.

NISSA CORNISH
Yeah.

NISSA CORNISH
to go

HOIKI LIU
for your own treasures. And it's actually very entertaining.

NISSA CORNISH
We often have, and this is one of my favorite moments. at Redress is when I'm working in our pop -up shop and I'm just out there on the floor. This happens less and less now because people are very familiar with our shops now. But in the early days, often you'd have people wander into the shop and ask for something in another size. And you'd say, well, that's the only size we have because it's a secondhand item. That's the only piece we have that looks like that in this shop. And almost 100 % of the time, people kind of register that and would go, oh. Okay. And keep shopping, you know, very seldom did anyone go, oh, secondhand and run. Yeah. So that's such a gratifying thing to see that people, you know, that switch of mindset, like right in front of your eyes. Yeah. So that's a really beautiful way that our pop -up shops, I think, have contributed to behavior change.

HOIKI LIU
Yeah. I think it's definitely, it's one of the things that people can recognize and see and participate and take action on right away. So, yeah. It's great.

NISSA CORNISH
So,

HOIKI LIU
Okay. So finally, I want to ask for really stories that's, that's, you know, that's really, you've already shared stories just now about how, you know, someone came in and, but are there other stories, partnerships that you forge or in the community that you feel like, oh, I need to share this story. This is how like somebody changed their mindset or had a really aha moment.

NISSA CORNISH
I'm not going to share about one person, although there are lots of those individual moments, but I will share this. One of my favorite things to do at Redress is running sorting activities. So because we run the citywide clothing collection year round, I didn't mention it earlier, but we have a year round clothing collection where you can drop off your unwanted clothes in boxes. We have partnerships in Zara and Swire locations and things like that. All that clothing comes back to our warehouse and it's... Over four tons a month, there's a lot of clothing. Our team can't sort it by ourselves, so we have people come in and volunteer to sort it. Usually it's community volunteers who sign up through Hands On Hong Kong, or it's corporate volunteers who have signed up through their company. The experience of being in our warehouse, floor to ceiling, filled with unwanted clothing, and then we dump these big boxes of clothing out on the table, and we explain to people how we're going to sort them so that they can have another life. You always get to see people go, oh my God. as they're sorting through clothing and discovering how much good quality stuff is in there, how much of it looks like clothing they have in their own closet, how much of it still has a brand new tag on it, or how much of it is low quality clothing that should never have been made in the first place, like different learning experiences that happen as you're helping us sort clothes. I love that because... Well,

HOIKI LIU
how much

NISSA CORNISH
first of all, we need those people. We need the manpower to help us get the job done. But I can see wheels turning and the questions people ask and the way that they respond and the way that they reflect on the exercise after it's completed makes it such a high quality activity for us. It's not you're just volunteering to help us out. It's you're coming and having something that you'll take with you as an experience that you remember and maybe impacts how you behave when next time you buy something to wear. So I love running those clothing sortings because it really helps us see people and be with people experiencing hands -on, like really getting elbow deep in the problem.

HOIKI LIU
problem. And it's really important. Actually, I brought this up with Christina last time. It's so important for the corporates and the companies and the businesses for their teams and their staff to come in. Because a lot of times it's like, you know, you've got your head of corporate or your head of sustainability department telling you guys, you know, we're a sustainable company. We're going to be more sustainable.

NISSA CORNISH
staff to come in.

HOIKI LIU
When it trickles down, it means nothing to your staff, you know? They're just like, oh, okay, our company's changed policies, you know? And it means nothing to them. But when they come in and they do the actual sorting and, you know, because like, for example, I'm in my office in Hong Kong, my merchandising staff, my accountant, even my pattern maker, actually none of them, all of them are very conscious shoppers and none of them are into fashion.

NISSA CORNISH
you know? They're just like,

HOIKI LIU
Right. In a manufacturing company, none of them are into fashion. They're all just, you know, doing this for their career as a job. This is how they know how things run, how things do. But occasionally when, like, I told Christina last time how the reason I downsized my whole factory and everything is because a customer was telling us how every time he orders from me. like a good 40 to 60 pieces goes directly to waste because they need to meet our minimums. And it's cheaper for them to buy that way than to buy that. Yeah. So, you know, even when my staff hears this, they think like, that's crazy. Yeah. Yeah. Like that is insane. That's crazy. But at the same time, we are shipping everything to this client. So it's just like a story that you hear. You're like, wow, this, this brand's insane. And you go back to work and you separate yourself. Yeah,

NISSA CORNISH
go back

HOIKI LIU
but I'm signing them up for this sort of firm this year so they can actually get in because we're always talking about how we're making a difference. But to them, what they're doing on the day -to -day, it doesn't reflect enough. It doesn't show them the difference that they're making. Even though we're giving our customers better options, more sustainable options, more choices to work towards sustainability. That's just part of a drill for them.

NISSA CORNISH
Yeah. Having the why, having that deeper understanding of where this is all coming from is definitely a really nice thing to be able to provide.

HOIKI LIU
Yeah. So I think this is how like, you know, we actually get built the community and not just touch on the surface. Yeah.

NISSA CORNISH
That's awesome. Yeah.

HOIKI LIU
So thank you so much for what you guys do. All right.

NISSA CORNISH
So thank you so much

HOIKI LIU
And to final, do you have any tips for our audience? personal habits that they can oh yeah how much time have you got i'll pick one and it's the one that i always lead with which is because people always ask the question like what's the most sustainable what's the most sustainable thing i can buy what's the most sustainable thing i can wear and my answer is always the most sustainable thing you can wear is what's already in your closet doesn't matter if you bought it at fast fashion doesn't matter if you bought it at a luxury price if you already own it

NISSA CORNISH
pick one and it's the one that i always lead with which is because people always ask the question like what's the most sustainable what's the most sustainable thing i can buy what's the most sustainable thing i can wear and my answer is always the most sustainable thing you can wear is what's already in your closet doesn't matter if you bought it at fast fashion doesn't matter if you bought it at a luxury price if you already own it

HOIKI LIU
wear it. Yes. Don't go buy something else. Yeah. And I think that that is a major thing for you because I'm sure every time you get in the donations, it must be shocking how many things still have their tags on. Oh my gosh. Shocking to me.

NISSA CORNISH
on. Oh my gosh. Shocking to me. Yeah.

HOIKI LIU
Yeah. And that's part of, you know, fashion being so disposable and so cheap that if you don't like it, just put it aside, you know, but people don't think, wear it as a side.

NISSA CORNISH
Yeah. That's a problem. Yeah.

HOIKI LIU
Yeah.

NISSA CORNISH
Yeah. And we don't think about how much goes into like if you buy a t -shirt off the rack in a fast fashion store and the t -shirt costs you maybe less than 200 less than 100 hong kong dollars and i we share this all the time to kids students in schools like you don't really think about this white cotton t -shirt that you'll maybe wear once and you throw away because it has a bit of a stain on it like someone planted cotton and then grew it and watered and fertilized it and a whole team of people that harvested it and then it was combed and woven and processed and treated and made into thread and then that was woven into fabric and that was maybe dyed and treated and processed and reprocessed and bleached and then that was cut into patterns and half of it was already thrown away at that point and then that was you know down the supply chain for 150 bucks you don't really think about any of that you know the hundred people that may have touched your piece exactly i always tell people when people think like oh why is this so expensive and i'm like you guys seem to forget how many hands

HOIKI LIU
exactly i always tell people when people think like oh why is this so expensive and i'm like you guys seem to forget how many hands past you know at a hundred dollars how much did each of those people get yeah exactly like if they each most of them at the end of they didn't even get a dollar yeah because then you're also talking about the margin that that fast fashion retailer or that fashion retailer puts on the clothing yeah wild and we just we don't

NISSA CORNISH
because then you're also talking about the margin that that fast fashion retailer or that fashion retailer puts on the clothing yeah wild and we just we don't We naturally don't tend to think about it. And it's a crazy,

HOIKI LIU
And it's a crazy, I mean, this goes back to the macro set, but it's a crazy old, like, you know, the way production lines were first, you know, like production lines only work when there's, when you reach that curve of, oh my God, I'm suddenly losing, not profitability, but like productivity. Yeah. You know, like, and. The thing is, with all the weight of it, productivity only comes with scale, you know, with experience, with time. So like making a first 50 piece of clothing, it's very, very slow and time consuming. But when you get to the 500 or 5 ,000 or 50 ,000, you can do it blind. Yeah. You know, and that's where we're always talking about profitability and productivity.

NISSA CORNISH
of it, productivity

NISSA CORNISH
you know,

NISSA CORNISH
You know,

HOIKI LIU
and productivity. It's a big fight.

NISSA CORNISH
Yeah, I would love for us to get back to a point where, or not back to a point where we spent half of our wages on clothing and therefore treasured them, but somehow take what we had in the past and what we've learned up till now and end up somewhere where we can enjoy and embrace fashion and express ourselves through our clothing and yet have respect for the clothing, you know, and treasure what we do on. And that's going to be part, I mean, part of that is having a more circular system in place throughout the fashion industries that the whole life cycle of a piece of clothing is respected and and we're responsible for it rather than currently each stage of the life cycle of clothing only takes responsibility for its stage as i as a consumer i'm only responsible for this piece of clothing from the moment i bought it to the moment i don't want it anymore and like i'm not responsible for what happens to get it to me and i'm not responsible for what happens after i get rid of it

HOIKI LIU
you know, and

NISSA CORNISH
of clothing is respected and and we're responsible for it rather than currently each stage of the life cycle of clothing only takes responsibility for its stage as i as a consumer i'm only responsible for this piece of clothing from the moment i bought it to the moment i don't want it anymore and like i'm not responsible for what happens to get it to me and i'm not responsible for what happens after i get rid of it And that's the case for every member of the life cycle or the supply chain. So that doesn't work.

HOIKI LIU
That's why I was like, when you're trying to take a line and bend it to a circle, you really have to break it down, like break it all apart. And then you can start to build a circle of it. But yes, thank you. And it was such a lovely conversation. And everybody, please join Get Redressed Month in May.

NISSA CORNISH
Thank you.

People on this episode

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Hoiki Liu

Host
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Nissa Cornish

Guest